- This topic has 22 replies, 9 voices, and was last updated 13 years, 7 months ago by
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Wow….
That kind of makes you wonder what the the rest of the welds look like
Hey TB…. here's a link to a Welder, Cutter, Cart, and Helmet set at Northern. Been thinking this would be nice to have. Have to replace an older welder. Or maybe I just think I have to. It's probably Chinese made. That means it should work on Chinese welds, right?
Came across this while researching.
http://www.northerntool.com/sh….._200467213
Jack
People are hilarious...
I'm supposed to choose and be in one of the 2 parties. And NEITHER is worth a damn! -
Jackpine wrote:
Have to replace an older welder. Or maybe I just think I have to.
No, you have to…
I finally replaced my Lincoln vertical “Bullet” even though it still works fineTinbender wrote:
Looks like it was DWW– Dirty When Welded.I'd say it was just tacked – not completed. The QA guy probably took that day off.
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It was “welded” all the way around. I'm glad I was in front of the house in close quarters. I had a front tire jambed against a rock unknowingly and instead of climbing over the rock it highlighted a defect. I would have to change my shorts if I was actually going somewhere. It's not going anywhere now
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Jack, if it doesn't say Lincoln or Miller I don't want it. The exception is my Dan Mig, no longer sold on this continent. Sweet hi frequency welder for thin stuff
The welder I”m using is the grandchild of my Lincoln SP 200 Power Source /W Mig guts installed. According to the book that came with it a fella can make 12 passes with 1/8″ inner shield wire to weld 3″ plate
I wouldn't know, nobody ever came into a shop I worked at with a battleship -
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I learned by both, 28 years as a bodyman. I bought my first welder, the Lincoln SP 200 when I was 16. I watched a film in school of the 1968 Camaro/Firebird sub frame assembly line, one of those welders at every station as far as the eye could see.
When the Corvette C5 body came out in 1997 for a time I was the only person in Oregon certified by GM to splice the frame after an accident. Those were the first hydro-formed frame rails on a production vehicle, common place now. That was quite an honor at the time, doesn't mean much now. Wonder how many miles of wire have been ran in those 28 years
I'd like to see Jack call Northern tools to find out who makes that welder and plasma cutter. If it's Hobart that would be good, I'd just hate to see anyone get stuck with Harbor Freight quality in welding equipment.
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I learned by being taught by a guy I worked for as a kid then continued to teach myself as the years went by. I still have a lot to learn, too!
That problem with the steering cylinder mount is a good illustration of the problem with MIG welders. Because it is dead simple to run a bead with a MIG welder, a lot of guys think they know how to weld when they really don't. They lay down these pretty as pie beads that have no penetration into the parent metal – exactly as shown on the steering arm. Without adequate penetration there is no real bonding, just a superficial tack that looks like a weld.
You never really saw this problem that much when there was only stick or gas welding – with either of those, if you can make a nice looking bead you've pretty much got to have good penetration.
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You've got that right Rich, I cant count how many cars I've worked on where the last guy thought he had welded a panel on, only to have it fly off while trying to make a pull. Now you have a real mess, you were counting on pulling on that outer panel to straighten the inner structure, now you're screwed. The car companies require MIG welds where a spot welder won't work and I hate to say there are a lot of bodymen with poor welding skills.
Some of the new cars have side panels made of hi boron steel to meet side impact requirements, the factories want those replaced with plug welds using silicone bronze wire to keep the heat down. If I owned a shop now I wouldn't hire a bodyman who was not a certified welder.
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The first day I used my 354 I was clearing some brush for a food plot and the bucket on the FEL broke right off. I couldn’t believe it- the bucket just broke right off. I was lucky to have some chain to tie the bucket back on to get back to my house. The weld was less 1/16” around the brackets. I didn’t think I was going to be a welder again since leaving General Dynamics Electric Boat Division in 1989. I had every certification for welding on any part/metal of a Nuclear Sub. Now that I got this tractor I have another hobby of welding. I have welded brackets, fittings to the sump tank, lines to the cylinders, and brazed fittings on the lines in my BH.
The Chinese welding process and QC is the worst I have ever seen. If you are going to have one of these tractors it pays to be a welder and have the equipment or know someone who does.
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Tin, my steering mount failed in EXACTLY the same way. I was moving snow, and suddenly noted that it wouldn't turn. Looked like an Indycar race after turn one. Could have been bad, but I was lucky. Hate to have been heading over to the neighbor's in top gear.
Your comments re new auto repair procedures were very interesting… I had no idea it was that complex. I have had some experience with pressure vessel maintenance, and know a little about the required welding processes for 850 psi boilers. Written procedures are a must. Do written procedures exist for your line of work, or is it every man for himself?
Mike
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Every manufacture has written procedures for where to splice, how to splice, the type, spacing and size of welds, etc.
The main problem is unlike any other profession besides medical the insurance companies dictate labor rates and therefore technician pay. When I started out body shops and mechanic shops charged the same rate, now body shops charge half as much, dictated by insurance companies. My pay per hour was far more 30 years ago than a body tech can expect today! So now you have low paid parts changers and a few dedicated souls.
Say you're a technician and you need to spend twenty minutes researching procedures for the task at hand. You will do that for free, just try to charge an insurance company a line item for that, good luck. Now that same technician is doing structural repairs on a Dodge Viper. Their procedures specifically state using strait Co2 instead of the usual Argon Co2 as the former gives a deeper, narrower weld. Do you think the average tech is going to research and learn this on his own time? His pay is low to begin with.
The newer Corvettes have their bodies bonded (glued) to the frame. You need to splice only the damaged section of body and frame. When I took the 3 day class for Corvette certification we were supplied actual frame sections to splice and spent a full day on how and where to splice them and final dimensions. Out of 30+ techs in the class not one other tech bothered to dial in his welder before starting! Most of these “Techs” could not weld to save their lives and blamed the machines (really sweet Miller welders) for their incompetence. They spliced in the wrong place or did not make the required joint, and could not produce the finished dimensions. That's over thirty $50,000 cars that would have been ruined during repair! Unfortunately this sort of thing plays out in shops across the US every day. I try to educate my customers (body shops) every chance I get as I'm one of the dedicated souls.
I'll get off my Soapbox now.
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Tin, that's a great post. Educated me a bit.
A few decades ago I was charged with leading the “Quality Improvement Process” (like “Quality is Job 1” at Ford, etc.) in our paper mill which employed about 1000 people at the time. The philosophy of doing it once and doing it right made sense at the time and it still does. However, there is a whole generation brought into the work force that has no idea of what QImprovement/QManagement is really about. On top of that, in spite of the huge gains in communication techniques, so much of the technology (like your post describes) has become so complex that it is very difficult to keep on top of. Then there is the huge pressure to do it cheaper (Jinma steering bracket, ruined Corvette frames) and a retreat of governmental regulation and it has once again become a bit of a crap shoot. (Not to defend governmental regulation, but here in Canada, like I assume is the case in the USA, too many regulators are self serving and needlessly impede business efficiency). But properly developed and efficiently enforced regulations do serve to provide a level playing field and a quality product. Unhappily, I don't see it happening here.
Now I'll get off MY box too.
As an aside, what IS your business? You educate body shops as part of it? I always thought you RAN a body shop.
Mike
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No Mike, I own an Autobody Paint and Supply Store, http://www.Tinbenderssupplies.com I was a Bodyman and Painter for 29 years. I have no secrets, and since I'm no longer using my knowledge might as well share it to help my customers
Click on my picture and it will go to my profile. -
HEY ERIC…..
I wasn't ignoring you. Just waiting to hear something back. The welder/plasma set is made in China. It is made “to Northern Tool specs”.
They are a pretty reputable company and it didn't seem to be as cheap looking as some of the others that I came across. They carry the repair parts on hand at Northern Tool. There is a 3 year warranty. It appears to be a “fair” setup for those doing hobby work. 
HOWEVER.. after my research, I'm going with a Millermatic 180. Sweeeet.
I found one new for $790. I thought about a little bigger one but I don't do that much heavy work. Besides, I have a stick to do that. After telling the wife I was “needing” a welder, she asked me why I needed it. I told her… because. That was the beginning of a discussion. 
Anyways, I'm still thinking about getting the cutter. It is easier than fighting with the Oxy, right?
Jack
People are hilarious...
I'm supposed to choose and be in one of the 2 parties. And NEITHER is worth a damn! -
Jack,
You're going to love that Millermatic. I have one of the Millermatic 175's – same welder, just an older model, and it has done yeoman service in my blacksmith's shop. I use it for everything from making jigs to building equipment and doing repairs, and it has never let me down. I push it to the limit and past at times, too. I generally run Ar/CO2 mix in it and mostly use .035 wire. I also have a cylinder of pure argon for when I run stainless or silicon bronze wire in it. I've never been sorry I got it.
I also have stick welders, TIG welders and O/A, but I use the MIG for 99% of my mild steel welding these days. I'd like to get another one to set up with a dedicated spool gun for aluminum, but that's down the road a ways, if ever.
I just got a plasma cutter the other day. I've always used the O/A for what little cutting I did, but I ran across a deal on the plasma that I couldn't pass up. A 60 amp plasma cutter for $400 with free delivery to my freight forwarder in Miami. It's a Chinese machine from an outfit called Longevity, Inc. I have a TIG welder I got from them a few years ago and ti's bee a fine machine so I figured I couldn't go wrong with the plasma. I hooked it up and tested it when it arrived and it worked fine but I haven't yet had a real use for it. I will, though. I have several projects in mind that the plasma will be real helpful on. Just have to find time to do them.
Have fun with your new welder!
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Larry, That's a really nice welder and well worth $2,000. The one we made the forks with is one size down from that. Here's its Grandpa http://weldingweb.com/showthre…..hp?t=46549
That's a picture of one just like the one I bought at age 16. It's in the garage at home with no 220
Not so great with thin sheetmetal, but great with anything else and makes a fine arc welder Sears used to sell a Lincoln TIG hi frequency box to mount on top, anyone know where a fella can get his hands on one of those? -
Jack, what Rich said.
When it comes to wire feed welders you NEED a smooth quality feed system, and cheaper welders will have a duty cycle that leaves you waiting more than welding Plasma cutters spray hot sparks farther than a torch but are far faster and more precise. Simply clamp a 2×4 for a guide and make a strait cut in nothing flat
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Larry,
So sorry to hear that. Although not as serious as rheumatoid arthritis can be, I was recently diagnosed as having osteo-arthritis. The onset was like yours, starting with the finger and moving to the right wrist and thumb, then to the left hand, this over the course of 1-1/2 weeks. I was thinking to myself WTF is this!! A two moth regimen of high powered anti-inflammatory and other drugs made me functional again – until next time.
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I too am sorry to hear that Larry. You and Bob have around twenty years on me.
My back is already worthless never knowing what will put me out of commission for weeks. I had a piece of cartilage the size of a finger come off my left lower leg bone and get jambed in the knee joint, had that removed 25 years ago. Since the ladder incident if I lift my right arm over my head the right way the whole right side of my core locks up causing extreme pain and breathing difficultly. After an accident 8 years ago it was recommended I get reconstruction or replacement of my right shoulder, I passed. Now I guess I have this to look forward to. I don't know a thing about arthritis but I hope the docs can keep it under control for you guys.
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