- This topic has 34 replies, 12 voices, and was last updated 13 years, 7 months ago by
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Copied from another thread:
While improvement is a noble goal, one has to weigh the cost/benefit. This site's value is that of a technical resource for Chinese tractor owners. The members spend a lot of time posting what they learn so others can benefit from their experiences. If every few years that collected knowledge gets flushed, the value of the site approaches zero. So if all the knowledge and experiences of members is lost, only potential exists. Personally, a couple site versions back, I posted pictures and discussions of modifications I've made to my tractor for the benefit of others. This included circuit diagrams and edited images. When the last site upgrade occurred all of that was archived and eventually lost. I no longer have the information to post it all again. Just this week I made modifications to the electrical system of my tractor and posted the diagrams on another tractor website. But honestly, I'm probably not going to make the effort to post them on CTOA because the site has sent a strong message to it's members that their iposting efforts and labors are only of value until a new website idea comes along.
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I can REALLY sympathize with the above.
i do not know about the “other site”, but THIS site is where my “imaginary on line friends”
hang out that KNOW about the malicious beavers in my part of the world.
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But the HELL of it is??
What degree of INCOMPETENCE or NOT GIVING A CRAP does it take
to DUMP the value of ALL THOSE POSTS AND INFO??
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I paid money to become a “lifetime member”:
I would presume that “ADS” provide some support:
therefore, as a VESTED participant,
I want to know WHY the change,
WHO was consulted,
and
WHAT will be done to correct the immediate past BLOW UP
of valuable information generated and contributed in GOOD FAITH
that it would help others of similar interest.???
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And if THIS constitutes “non -support”,
then it is further indication of the PROBLEM being referred to.
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My name is David O. Newell
I'm a PE
I'm a management consultant
I am a principal at a BB with 6,000 members.
Mostly, though,
I own a Yuchai dozer, and that's why I've been here.
And if you can't get the old board archived for access,
then you should not even PRETEND to competence in this arena.
Irritated,
David
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PS:
in re the issue of amending posts after subsequent follow ons,
if there is a reason to do so because of “bad information”,
or otherwise:
it can (and should ) be done by
'administrative overide tag”,such as
which will automatically redirect, when selected.
Generally, if it's not a “resource” or “safety” problem, it's not important to correct an “a priori” error, which DOES only cause “confusion” and makes the “responder ” look stupid.
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Sorry, You are so upset. Life isn't perfect nor are websites. The prior site data is NOT LOST it is still there, just not compatable to just PLUG into a new forum. The CTOA gains its best benfit from eveyone helping each other with questions and answers. Even on the last forum, the older site before it eventually stopped being looked at because it becomes OUTDATED.
Also, READ THE HISTORY OF CTOA to learn who I AM !! If you have an issue sorry. Also, please note that if you start to attack and be negative and bash.. YOU WILL BE BANNED.. because I will not allow that JUST BECAUSE IT BECAME NECESSARY TO MAKE THIS SITE UPGRADED TO A MORE STABLE PLATFORM.
Again..if you read my post on here the old forums are not lost, and if you have the tech knowledge to somehow make them a easily search-able ARCHIVE by all mean volunteer your help my friend. From the old forum
Prior Board Statistic
Total Topics 3227 | Total Posts 32546 | Total Views 4129105 (a lot to figure out how to archive)This new site is based on creating a better friendship for its members of which I think is a wonderful benefit. Already post are hitting the site and being responded too, that is our true assest.
CTOA - Founder
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Buddy, you do whatever you want.
First of all, on line storage is REAL CHEAP, and if you want to prove your point, go to your host interface and post the bandwidth versus allowable statistics.
Second of all, SEARCH ENGINES just for the archives are really easy to deploy.
Third of all, YOU could select the “resource” threads and import them.
But let's get down to your asessment of what I'm offerring you.
You are saying that my negativity constitutes a “BANNING OFFENSE”, is that right?
What is there about what I've stated that causes you the greatest problem, CTOA?
I invite your dialogue, defense, or OTHER basis for your threat, promise, or action.
What you do characterizes you WITHOUT FAIL.
I'm not after YOU:
I'm NAILING your “job function”: just as several others have.
And because of THAT..??
You start growling “BANNING” and etc?
My advice will never change:
“Do what you want.”
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David, I for one have just enough computer sense to get myself in trouble, so I am of no help to Hal
You, on the other hand sound like you could be of assistance, so I'll make you a deal
I certainly don't like the rhetoric getting to the banishment point, soooooo
You help Hal get the old posts on to this site, I'll mail you a check for $15.00
If you feel you have been wronged paying for a membership for something you are no longer
happy with, I'll sent you a check for $15.00
The man is doing his best, beating him over the head with a keyboard isn't going to improve the site.
ANY member who can genuinely help PLEASE DO.
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Sorry you feel that way David, I feel you could be a great asset to the site development. I have migrated sites before, and when you're doing it all in your “spare time” it makes it even tougher.
In your infinite wisdom you must surely understand that behind any change, regardless of how it is driven, there will be dissent from conservatives – and collateral damage. So far I only know of two ex-prominent members that have detracted, understandable considering their situations.
I think a migration rate over 95% would be impossible anyway.
I'm just sayin'
I'm behind Tinbender – I'll send you a check too. PM me your address.
Account deleted.
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well, it will be as it is. Private messages have been sent.
One thing which I will say here is that Hal is surely a fine person,
and I do not believe that I said anything against his “beingness”,
although his “functionality” here appears worthy of denegration.
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And I will say this in case it is not clear:
1. Focussed criticism is INSANELY more valuable than compliments and ass-kissing.
(And I do believe that I may have caught a bit of that, as a “taint” in the air,
but may be wrong and it isn't that important:
it's just what “we humans” do..)
2. If this matter had NOT been brought up,
a. Hal would glissando through the matter without further regard,
as he apparently has before, (and may do t again)
b. Hal would not have received written suggestions as to exactly how he might
salvage this “out the window” baby/bathwater situation..
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Thanks for the “$15 back” offer.
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I'll assist Hal if he really wants it.
What is the name of the software,
what is the edition number
where is the site hosted
what are the bandwidth statistics
what was the prior software, edition, host, etc..
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(delete)
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thank you.
d
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Knowledge about Chinese tractors and dozers isn't the only way you can contribute to this site. I think Hal did an excellent job for someone who doesn't make a living doing web sites.
I also am with Tinbender. You sound like you could be of assistance, so I'll make you a deal.
I certainly don't like the rhetoric getting to the banishment point either, so you help Hal get the old posts on to this site, I'll mail you a check for $15.00
Grumpy
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The DATA IS NOT LOST…JUST OFFLINE..I am testing to see if I can make the old forum just viewable etc…while working on a way to port the data into a archive. I decided to make the move after the site was shut down my the hosting company becasue of virus issues (one problem with the older site software).
I have been wanting to move the site to a new platform for over a year. I have attempted to update the old software numerous time with fatal errors and lost data so I finally gave up and decided on this new style. Give me some time and it will all be fine!
CTOA - Founder
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I deleted it, and have warned him to be more polite here. I appreciate input and help, but not attacking my purpose and love for the CTOA site.
Beleive it or not that is the first person I felt I needed to remove a post from in over 4+ years. Think about that for a moment.
Our OLDEST site use to have lots of bashing and hate statement..I am not going to let that be the focus here. I am doing my best and ask for patience that is all.
Again sorry for those unhappy folks here. But, please be respectful thats all.
Our tag line I have used for over 10 years is “Helping Each Other With Knowledge” not bashing and attacking. Please all be nice to each other.
Sincerely,
Hal M
CTOA
CTOA - Founder
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I've tried to hold my breath
I know Hal is doing what he can ,the new sites been up what? 45 hrs.?Hey, I have been around long enough to know the difference between supporting someone I believe is doing the best of their ability's in a given time frame and kissing someones butt. The audacity of some clown who doesn't even know me calling me a butt kisser? Sorry, David, you're WAY out of line. Take some Midol and call me in the morning girl
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I JUST DID A LONG COMMENT ON ANOTHER POST; BU I FEEL THE NEED TO ADD TO THIS ONE;
FIRST I DON'T KNOW HAL PERSONALY; BUT I DO KNOW THAT THROUGH THE YEARS, WHEN I HAVE MADE SUGGESTIONS TO HIM, OR HAD PROBLEMS WITH THE SITE, THAT HE HAS ALWAYS BEEN VERY RESPONSIVE, AND TRIED TO WORK THINGS OUT ;
THIS MOVE IS SOMETHING NEW TO MANY OF US BUT NOT ALL, SOME CAN REMEMBER THE MOVE FROM THE HOMESTEAD SITE TO THE ONE WE JUST LEFT; I DON'T REMEMBER ALL THAT WENT ON IN THAT MOVE, BUT I DO REMEMBER THAT WITH TIME WHAT WE HAD WAS SOMETHING VERY MUCH BETTER THAN WHAT WE HAD BEFORE;
TIME DOESN'T HEAL ALL WOUNDS, BUT IT DOES LET THINGS PROGRESS , AND I FEEL THAT IS WHAT WE NEED NOW IS TIME, TO SEE WHAT PROGRESSES AND EACH OF US CAN HAVE A HAND IN STEERING THIS SITE TO GREATER ACCOMPLISHMENTS ;
LEON
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Wow, what a tempest in a teapot!
Hal is doing what he thinks is best for the long-term survial and growth of CTOA – fine, it's his site and he can do as he likes with it, including shutting it down completely if he's so moved. I think Hal's motives are certainly clear – he wants CTOA to be the best it can be. He's doing something I certainly couldn't/wouldn't do so I'm not about to bash him over how it gets done.
Yeah, I “paid” my fifteen bucks. That doesn't make me a “vested” partner in the site, though. Far from it. That fifteen bucks is a donation to help defray costs. And a damn cheap one at that! If fifteen bucks is such a big hit to anyone's wallet that they can't afford it to help out a site they use regularly then perhaps they should cut expenses by selling the computer? Just a thought…
I don't know if Hal can get the old posts archived for search or not…way ove rmy pay grade. If he can, that would be great. If not, I doubt it's a huge loss as I notice that most people ask the same questions over and over and get answered about every time. The real resource here is the people, not the posts. Hal hasn't deleted any people, as far as I know. Sure, a few may delete themselves because they're miffed with the changes – can't help that, it's a free country. Sorry to see the good ones go, bon voyage to the ones who weren't that great when they were around before.
I have neither the technical skills nor the time to help out with the site's cnstruction/maintenance so I'm delighted Hal is willing to do so. Since I'm not part of the solution I certainly won't be part of the problem by bitching about how he does it.
Rich Waugh
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Note that the comments are becoming personal,
and that the leader has decided to remove posts despite their support for functional improvem,ents based on honest opinions.
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I believe he would be better off going back to the old software, and he could expect some help in getting it done correctly through proper migreation of content.
This is not about “Hal”, nor is it about my “imputed hostility”.
I was asked to help, and have, yet the nature of the commentary is directed personmally against my user name.
Which is fine: I'm neither my “user name” , nor Whatever you may think of me.”
Bob and Hal have a mutuality of self support that was not obvious until Bob posted his non sense.
Hal should entertain providing a link to a forum wherin he asked for some help in re the migration problems h could not handle correctly.
(Which would give some credibility to his statements..)
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Soon, Hal willl be tempted to actually change my posts, so that he can maintain the image he likes to project. “Powah” does that…
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I tried to support this site, and those that think otherwise are wrong.
Sorry to lose the resource:
I made a mistake about Bob:
good luck.
David
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David Said
Hal should entertain providing a link to a forum wherin he asked for some help in re the migration problems h could not handle correctly.
(Which would give some credibility to his statements..)
If you feel I have to prove my credibility here on a site I am very PROUD of after 10 years, then you really need to rethink being a member here on the CTOA. Again, READ THE HISTORY. My loyalty to this group is something I don't need to prove, the proof is in the fact the CTOA is here online.
Again, why not try to be more personal, upload your pic, update info to your profile and try to be more than just a as you say, a USERNAME on this great site.
CTOA - Founder
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RALPH YOUR ABOVE POST JUST SAVED ME A LOT OF TYPING,
IF THE POST FROM THE OLD SITE CAN BE SALVAGED GREAT, IF NOT THEN AS RALPH SAID , AS LONG AS WE HAVE OUR MOST IMPORTANT RESOURCE, OUR MEMBERS THEN WE HAVE ALL THE SEED THAT WE NEED TO BUILD ON.
I AM NOT REAL GOOD ON FINDING MY WAY AROUND A NEW SITE BE IT THIS ONE OR OTHERS THAT I VISIT; BUT AS LONG AS THE MEMBERSHIP HAS A CAN DO ATTUTIDE, IT IS WORTH THE EFFORT;
AS RALPH SAID MOST QUESTIONS FROM THE OLD SITE WERE ASK MORE THAN ONCE; AND I KNOW WHEN I AM BROKE DOWN AND NEED HELP IT IS EASIER TO JUST ASK, MOST OF THE TIME I DON'T WANT TO SPEND AN HOUR OR SO SEARCHING OLD POST TO FIND THE INFO THAT I NEED, AND AS I SAID THE RESORCES THAT I NEED ARE IN THE MEMBERS NOT IS OLD POST;
I UNDERSTAND THAT SOME INVESTED TIME IN DOING SKETCHES AND SUCH ON THE PREVIOUS SITE, EVEN PICS; THAT SEVERAL WOULD LIKE TO SAVE; AND I DON'T KNOW IF IT WOULD WORK OR NOT, BUT MY SUGGESTION ON THAT WOULD BE ;;;;
FOR HAL IF HE CAN SET THAT SITE AS A READ ONLY SITE, SAY CTOA#A OR SOMETHING WITH A LINK THAT COULD ONLY BE ACCESSED FOR THIS SITE; WHICH WOULD ALLOW THE MEMBERS THAT WISH COULD ACCESS WHAT THEY NEED FOR SAY 90 DAYS AND COPY AND PASTE THEM BACK TO A FILE ON THEIR COMPUTER, AND IF THEY HAVE THE NEED OR DESIRE THEY COULD REPOST HERE, USING SOME METHOD THAT HAL OR OTHERS COULD RECOMMEND AS FOR MYSELF I SPENT TIME RESPONDING TO QUESTIONS ON THE PREVIOUS SITE ; BUT I WOULD NOT BE BURNDENED IF I NEED TO ANSWER THE SAME QUESTIONS ; HERE;;;;
OPINIONS ARE LIKE BODY PARTS SOME WE HAVE ONE OF AND OTHERS WE HAVE MANY;
BUT OTHER THAN ASKING ( “NICELY” ) ABOUT SOMETHING THAT WE FEEL COULD BENIFIT THE MEMBERS AND FUTURE MEMBERS OF ( ” THIS THIS THIS THIS ” ) SITE I FEEL THAT WE SHOULD LET CTOA GET THE BUGS OUT AND GET ON WITH HELPING OTHERS WITH THEIR TRACTOR/DOZER PROBLEMS
LEON
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I have been switching the old forums to READ only and working on making them available as a resource, like you said, maybe for a specific time into the future. I actually am in the process of turning the site on.
Try CLICKING HERE to see if it opens the OLD FORUMS PAGE
CTOA - Founder
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WORKS GOOD FOR ME ; ONLY ONE HITCH THAT I CAN SEE IS THAT I WAS ONLY ABLE TO ACCESS THE DOZER FORMS
LEON
I JUST CHECKED AND IN THE SEARCH BOX I TYPED MAILMAN55 AND ON THE PROFILE PAGE I WAS ABLE TO ACCESS ALL POST THAT I HAVE POSTED ON ALL THE WAY BACK TO 2006 WHICH I GUESS IS ABOUT THE TIME I BECAME A PAYING MEMBER , WITH THIS I COULD COPY AND SAVE ANY POST THAT I DESIRE TO;
GOOD SHOW
LEON
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Good for you Hal:
turns out it wasn't all that difficult after all.
and to think, all the “Sturm und Drang”:
hardly worth the cost of admission,
but at least you know somones interested, eh?
You said:
'”You are about to not be welcome on this website.
Your attitude is poor.
So, please be nice or LEAVE !! “
Well, Hal:
Sorry I failed to meet your expectations:
you already said “I was not a nice person..”.
I asked you to define “nice”, but you wouldn't.
I feel that my attitude is just what you need,
to get you to rise above complacency
and understand MORE about your function.
You may have noted that I'm not much at ass kissing:
and I believe that “Being a nice guy”, to you,
involves healthy amounts of those qualities.
Kudos to you for finding a way to make available
the information you were throwing away. Very good response
to a direct criticism of what you were about. Thats called “GOOD WORK”,
Hal.
So, Hal, is this post “nice”?
I would call it “direct” and “the truth” from where I sit.
But YOU are the one Who Decides, Hal.
If it isn't “nice”, delete my account, if you would.
thank you.
David
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DavidIAM said
If it isn't “nice”, delete my account, if you would
If I deleted it, that would NOT BE NICE. However, you didn't cause me to do anything I wasn't already in the process of doing, if you actually cared and read, you would have known I have been sick as a dog during all this process too.
Also, why not update your profile and try to be more personal yourself here, that is the whole idea of this new site vision. Give it a try, who knows you might actually like it.
CTOA - Founder
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